Lizzy and Lissa break down the hidden costs – financial and otherwise – of concerts. From skyrocketing ticket prices to hidden costs like fees and merch, they weigh the value of these unforgettable experiences against their various costs.
Lizzy and Lissa break down the hidden costs – financial and otherwise – of concerts. From skyrocketing ticket prices to hidden costs like fees and merch, they weigh the value of these unforgettable experiences against their various costs.
Main Topics
00:00 Introduction: The Rising Cost of Concerts
01:18 Running The Numbers Segment
03:04 The Cost of Attending Concerts
06:16 The Emotional and Logistical Costs
18:58 Our Favorite Concerts
23:07 Front and Center: VIP Experiences
25:43 Concert Preferences and Priorities
27:19 Concert Pet Peeves
30:06 Post-Pandemic Concert Experiences
37:08 Music Festivals
41:26 20 Cents Segment
References for Statistics
https://www.statista.com/statistics/272756/the-most-successful-music-tours-worldwide/
https://www.statista.com/statistics/380106/global-average-music-tour-ticket-price/
https://www.innerbody.com/concert-attendance-and-enthusiasm
Lissa: According to Statista, in 2023, it cost an average of $130 to see an artist in the US live in concert. This marks a substantial increase from 2015 when a ticket averaged $78.
Lizzy: Damn.
Lissa: Do you go to a lot of concerts?
Lizzy: Yes. Slowed down a little bit.
Lissa: Long story short, yes. All right. Well, today we're talking about our concerts worth it?
Lizzy: Let's talk about it.
Lissa: Welcome to Net Net with Lizzy and Lissa, where we analyze hidden costs and empower you to make your own damn decisions in life. Each episode covers a different facet of life, and at the end of each episode, we each give our takes on whether we think something is net positive or net negative.
Lizzy: I'm Lizzie, a strategist and consultant with almost 20 years of experience in finance and investing.
Lissa: And I'm Lissa, a personal finance expert and a Certified Financial Planner. We're best friends who talk about money and everything else. Are concerts worth it?
Lizzy: First up, running the numbers on concerts.
Lissa: Taylor Swift's Eras Tour. It's Eras Tour, right?
Lizzy: Eras Tour. Yes.
Lissa: That's how you say it? This is how dumb I am when it comes to Taylor Swift. Taylor Swift's Eras Tour was the first tour to gross over a billion US dollars around the globe.
Lizzy: Sheesh. All right. Taylor Swift nearly doubled the gross revenue of Beyonce's Renaissance Tour in 2023. Beyonce ranked second on the list, grossing $580 million US, which is a lot for one tour.
Lissa: That's a lot, lot. Yeah.
Lizzy: That's insane.
Lissa: That's crazy. In terms of how many people are going to concerts, Live Nation, who owns Ticketmaster, said that 145 million fans attended more than 50,000 events in 2023.
Lizzy: Wow.
Lissa: Yeah. And that's obviously only events through...
Lizzy: Through Live Nation concerts, yeah.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: Okay. The Hollywood Reporter says that Ticketmaster sold 620 million tickets in 2023.
Lissa: Yeesh, yeesh.
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: What's the population of the US? 330, something like that?
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: So people are going to a hella concerts. A survey from Innerbody.com reports that 59% of respondents were willing to take on more debt to see their favorite artist perform live.
Lizzy: Dang. Not advised.
Lissa: Not advised, but I've done that in the past, so no judgment here for sure.
Lizzy: They also said that concert goers are willing to spend up to $843 on average for floor seats.
Lissa: So the best seats possible?
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: Well, we know there's more to life than numbers and statistics, so let's talk about it. Are concerts worth it?
Lizzy: All right. First let's talk about the financial costs or the costs of going to concerts.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: So the obvious is the ticket price.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: And as we have heard, that can be substantial and is growing significantly. That stat was really interesting, just like anecdotally it feels like concerts are so expensive now.
Lissa: Yeah. So basically, obviously with inflation, costs of everything rises.
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: But for concerts specifically, it's doubled.
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: In eight, nine years. So to see your... Unless your salary or pay has doubled, how are you going to consistently keep up going to the concerts that you want to go to, especially bigger artists?
Lizzy: Yeah., I think in particular for bigger artists. And then, there's also other associated costs, right? So I went to a concert a few weeks ago. I went and saw Billie Eilish with some friends. I didn't have to pay for the tickets, which was nice, but parking was $80, $80 for parking.
Lissa: Oh, my gosh.
Lizzy: So there are other costs.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: And a lot of people now, a lot of venues, they'll have drinks. They'll have food even.
Lissa: Merch.
Lizzy: Merch, merch, merch.
Lissa: As you can see, we are merch people.
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: We are merch people. Yeah. So there's a lot of costs tied for the experience. And just to add to the ticket price thing is those average ticket prices, if you've ever been to a concert, you know there's a range. You can get, I don't know, general admission or not so great seats ranging up to like a VIP experience, front row. And the crazy part is if the lowest ticket tier is already, let's say, $100 or something, you pay that. And sometimes you can hardly see what's going on on stage. Maybe you get pushed.
Lizzy: You're just watching a screen.
Lissa: Maybe you have to stand and you don't have a seat. Maybe you're getting pushed around. There's a lot of factors to consider. And again, we're talking about the biggest artists, because you can go to smaller events that are different.
Lizzy: Yeah. But even those have gone up significantly I feel like.
Lissa: Yeah?
Lizzy: Yeah. It used to be, depending on the venue or the genre or whatever, you could go see someone for like $20 on a random night. Now it's $80 or something.
Lissa: Yeah. Especially also if you go to festivals like Coachella or things like that, then you are now having to save for multiple months out of your paychecks to make sure you have enough money for this experience.
Lizzy: Right. And it's important to note the economic context for this, which is that as the music industry has changed, artists are not making money off of the music itself. Streaming artists make nothing almost.
Lissa: Yeah. Not as much. You have to be big.
Lizzy: You can have millions, hundreds of millions of streams, and it's a small fraction of-
Lissa: What it used to be.
Lizzy: What it used to be, yeah.
Lissa: When you had record sales and things like that.
Lizzy: Yeah. So now artists primarily profit from concerts, from tours. And so they're-
Lissa: Or sponsorships and things like that.
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: All the outside things beyond the actual music itself.
Lizzy: The music itself. Yeah. So that's been a huge part of this dynamic shift.
Lissa: Yeah. And I will add, I don't see concerts going away because it's such a unique experience. I know we're going to talk about the benefits in a second, but just the experience that you have that you can't replace. You can watch something on TV, but it's just not the same as being there live. So I don't know if it's a monopolistic market.
Lizzy: Right. Yeah.
Lissa: Or it's very unique that they could charge whatever.
Lizzy: And people will go.
Lissa: And people will go.
Lizzy: Well, and I think that's what we are seeing with a Taylor Swift, for example. She is so in demand and so popular that people will go, no matter the price.
Lissa: I have many friends. My sister is a Swiftie, one of my cousins is a Swiftie. They're not batting an eye at a $1,000 ticket, minimum, minimum, $1,500 minimum. And I'm like, "What?" I'd never. I'd rather spend that doing something else, but that's just me.
Lizzy: Sure.
Lissa: But if it was like Beyonce, I'd probably do the same thing.
Lizzy: Right. Right. And different artists mean different things to different people. Yeah.
Lissa: Yeah. All right. So financial cost obviously is major, major cost if you are a concert goer.
Lizzy: Any other costs?
Lissa: Oh, well, I guess kind of there's a cost of potential disappointment.
Lizzy: Oh, yeah.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: Interesting. So that could be they don't perform well live. If you've ever been to a Lauryn Hill concert, I've been to a few. She was actually fairly on time the two I've been to.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: But yeah, they-
Lissa: Artists don't show up.
Lizzy: They show up late.
Lissa: They're late.
Lizzy: The sound is bad. There's some kind of issue with it. You have annoying people around you ruining your experience.
Lissa: I've gone to a festival, Rock the Bells when it was scorching hot.
Lizzy: Oh yeah.
Lissa: Still had a blast. I was younger so I could handle the discomfort. But it's that kind of thing where you're like, "Oh, my God. I'm sweating, my feet hurt, my legs hurt." So there's stuff like that.
Lizzy: Well, that actually reminds me, this was back in college, I went to Sun God, which is UCSD.
Lissa: San Diego?
Lizzy: San Diego's annual concert.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: And Drake was there. This was right when Drake first came out. And the crowd got so crazy, I didn't feel safe.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: And so, we actually left. I didn't end up seeing him. And then, you hear about Astroworld-
Lissa: Astroworld.
Lizzy: ... and things like that. So there are legitimate safety concerns when crowds get too big and too intense.
Lissa: Mm-hmm. It's just that right mixture of the type of crowd, do they proper staffing and security? Did they oversell the venue?
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: Right? So yeah. Safety is a potential cost.
Lizzy: For sure.
Lissa: Hopefully no one ever has to deal with that. But that comes to my mind whenever I think of going to crowded places.
Lizzy: Yeah. And so, then that leads me to another one, which is the logistical cost.
Lissa: Oh, gosh.
Lizzy: So I mentioned I went to this concert recently, and I am living now currently fairly far outside of the city. And this was at-
Lissa: Far outside of Los Angeles.
Lizzy: Far outside of Los Angeles. It's like 30 miles, which without traffic is not a big deal. But this is in further south in Inglewood, California where the Forum is. And so, it was like two hours to get there, in traffic, just the traffic to get into the parking to pay $80. There's all of these kids, so this is a weird social cost of I felt so old. I got stared down by an 11-year-old of like, "Why are you here"
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: And then, just the people, the crowds, getting in and out, finding a bathroom. And it's a lot. And I think as I get older, that part weighs on me more. It was an amazing experience. She was great. But I'm kind of like, "I could have just stayed home."
Lissa: Yeah. That's how I feel a lot of the time. But I will say that a big part of that is me getting older and I just value comfort so much.
Lizzy: Yes.
Lissa: And it's because we've had our glory days.
Lizzy: We've had them, girl.
Lissa: So part of the reason we came up with this episode idea is obviously we talk about everything, but a couple months ago, sometime last year, Liz, who is so busy studying, working, raising a puppy, she just sends me on WhatsApp, a spreadsheet called Concerts. And she's like-
Lizzy: This is a ADHD, y'all. This is ADHD.
Lissa: She's like, "Hey, I made a list of all the concerts I've ever been to. Since you've been to a lot of them with me, I put your name on them too so you can start your list here if you want." And I was like, "Okay, cool. Great." Because I wanted this data. It's actually cool data.
Lizzy: It is cool data.
Lissa: And so, that's kind of the start of this episode.
Lizzy: That's what started it.
Lissa: We have this list. And it's definitely incomplete because you mentioned earlier, I've gone to so many concerts where I'm so grateful that I went for free through my job. So my list has like 45 on it. Yours has 45.
Lizzy: 45, yeah.
Lissa: Same thing. But I think we've gone to way more than that.
Lizzy: Yeah. We've got to fill it in.
Lissa: We've got to fill it in.
Lizzy: There's a lot that I could remember.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: And then, particularly if you live in LA, for example, where there's so many stars here, you get a lot of special guests.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: So that was the other thing I wanted to track is okay-
Lissa: Who have you seen?
Lizzy: We saw Jay-Z and Kanye at UCLA, but they brought out Rihanna.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: Right? Or Billie Eilish. She brought out Charlie XCX.
Lissa: Everyone and their mama brings out Snoop Dogg.
Lizzy: Everybody brings out Snoop. Snoop's all up in the concerts. Yeah.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: So anyway, so that was my ADHD. I just suddenly had to have this spreadsheet because I have a spreadsheet for everything. And it started this. So we have been to dozens of concerts together throughout our friendship.
Lissa: Yeah. And I'd say that to me kind of ended pre-pandemic. I've gone to shows here and there since the pandemic. And it wasn't the pandemic that changed that for me. It was my growth into wanting to have more comfort and not caring as much to go to concerts. But all that concert going to me was probably in the 2010s era.
Lizzy: Yeah. We had a real tear, 2016 to 2018 we went pretty crazy.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: And then, I think that slowed down a little. I got in a relationship and I was living in Irvine. And then, the pandemic happened and your life's situations happened. So yeah, it slowed down, but that was probably the peak for me personally.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: We went to a lot.
Lissa: I remember 2016, I couldn't tell you how much I spent on concerts because not only did I go to a ton of major, big concerts like Drake, Beyonce, Jay-Z, but I was buying VIP tickets.
Lizzy: Yeah, you were.
Lissa: Because I guess I graduated to this point where I was like, "If I'm going to go, I want it to be comfortable, where I can see the artist, where I can get some merch, and then in some instances, meet the band."
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: Like TLC. You weren't there. You were there.
Lizzy: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. That was amazing.
Lissa: You have the... Yeah, that time when we met-
Lizzy: I got the same shirt. I almost wore it.
Lissa: Yeah. So it was like, I met Miguel. I forget what year that was, but he did a show at the Hollywood Cemetery, and I did a VIP ticket thing and we got to take pictures with him.
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: So it's like I cared-
Lizzy: We were right there.
Lissa: Yeah. I cared a lot more about those things before, like, "Oh, my God, I just want to meet and shake your hand or take a picture with you."
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: Where now I'm just like, "Eh, it's cool."
Lizzy: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, same. That was great for that time.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: Yeah. Story time.
Lissa: Story time.
Lizzy: We went to a concert in Orange County, so about an hour south of here. I think it was when we saw Khalid.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: And you I think had recently had a knee surgery.
Lissa: Yeah. I had an injury.
Lizzy: Yeah, an injury.
Lissa: I just couldn't walk far.
Lizzy: Yeah. And this is a smaller venue, which is really cool because a lot of up and coming artists that later blow up come through this venue. But parking isn't great there. It's weird logistically. And it gets just so overcrowded. Right? So we're pulling up to this venue and everyone is like 12, and we're in our maybe late 20s.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: I think I was like 27, 28, 30. But they're children, like kids. And we're looking all around and we had just regular tickets.
Lissa: Yeah. Yeah. And the regular ticket line to get in was so long.
Lizzy: Yeah, we didn't think we were going to get in. That's what it was. And I don't remember we did they not have guaranteed tickets? There was something. We didn't think we were going to get in, and Lissa was just like, it, "Fuck it. I'm buying a bottle."
Lissa: Yeah. Because they had VIP tables available that was kind of-
Lizzy: Elevated.
Lissa: ... elevated. You could see the stage.
Lizzy: You have a seat.
Lissa: You have a whole couch.
Lizzy: Because it was all standing room, I think?
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: And so, this was, yeah, you have a seat, you have a view. There's no riff-raff around you.
Lissa: And I think back then you didn't really drink.
Lizzy: I didn't drink at all.
Lissa: You didn't drink and I wasn't planning to drink.
Lizzy: Because you were driving.
Lissa: Because I was driving. So we got this bottle of champagne, and we're just like, we just paid for a ticket. That's what we-
Lizzy: Basically, yeah.
Lissa: ... justified.
Lizzy: But that epitomizes Lissa in that era.
Lissa: Yeah, I'm not going to stand in this line.
Lizzy: Fuck this riff raff. I'm not waiting in line. I'm buying a bottle.
Lissa: It's like waiting in line for an hour and maybe not get in after we've already driven an hour and a half to get here just so we could pay $30 for a ticket when we could buy it for $250.
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: Right?
Lizzy: It was worth it.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: It was definitely worth it.
Lissa: Obviously, you have to have money to make decisions like that, like extra flex bucket money.
Lizzy: Yeah. It was a great time though.
Lissa: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So great story. I forgot about that. So another thing I was thinking of is during my concerts era, I don't know if it's just me the person, because I know other people who remember so many details about every experience they went to. I think I was starting to feel like, "I don't even remember the concerts I've been to. Why am I spending all this money?" It's a great experience in that moment, and then it's a fleeting memory for me. And I always thought that when you have a strong emotional tie to an event or something that's happening, you remember it better.
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: But I can only remember a handful of concerts in my time.
Lizzy: Yeah, I don't remember them in depth. I can think of... I get an image or a sense of what the feeling was, but I don't remember a lot of the details.
Lissa: I can't remember who I was with at a lot of them.
Lizzy: Oh, really?
Lissa: I'm surprised you do. Yeah.
Lizzy: I'm pretty good with that part, I think. But it was pretty much all with you, not all, but a lot of them.
Lissa: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Lizzy: But I don't remember a ton of... There were people I looked up a concert that I went to and, "Oh, they came out?" I didn't remember. I didn't know I'd seen them in concert. I think one was Kendrick Lamar when he was really early and I'm like, "Oh, I guess I've seen Kendrick Lamar." Right?
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: So yeah, I kind of have a similar thing.
Lissa: I have been blessed to work in places where I've been able to go for free.
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: I just remembered before I worked at Google, I worked at Fox Sports, but in the music department. So we would procure music to put on broadcast television. But because of that, and we live in la, we had access to these showcases, which is not technically a concert. It's like you go to a very, very small venue, and it's an up and coming artist and they play a few songs for people in the industry. So I got to go to quite a few of those. And the one most notable for me, because my genre was Miguel.
Lizzy: Oh, yeah. That's cool.
Lissa: So I did actually see him before his album dropped and everything like that. And it was really cool because you're like, "This guy's talented. He can sing." So yeah, I'm like, now I'm thinking, "Okay, maybe I do have good memories."
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: Yeah. Live music is just great.
Lizzy: So for me, grew up in a musical family. My dad is a professional guitarist, so this is 45, 50 concerts, not including the hundreds of times I've seen my dad play in a small venue-
Lissa: Shows. Mm-hmm.
Lizzy: ... a big venue since I was born, my entire life. So it's just so normalized for me. My dad would go on tour, that's what you do. He's got a gig, you go watch, and you're just around live music. So to some extent it's in my blood, but I kind of found my own way with it.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: Do you have a favorite concert?
Lissa: For the longest time, my answer was Kanye West Glow in the Dark Tour. I don't even remember what year that was, because it was one of the first big concerts that I went to of one of my favorite artists and favorite albums. And it was so cool and artistic the way he did the show. It wasn't just someone coming out to rap or sing, go away, come back, and do it. It was like a whole story.
Lizzy: Yeah, sure.
Lissa: That's what I felt, for anyone who actually went to it. After that I would say Watch the Throne, which was Jay-Z and Kanye, and I was able to go twice.
Lizzy: Oh.
Lissa: I had bought tickets and then through my job, I was able to go for free. So they played three shows back to back, I think, in Los Angeles. And I went to the first and third one.
Lizzy: Oh, that's cool.
Lissa: So I had a break in between. So it was so good, and maybe it resonates with me more and it's more memorable because I went twice.
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: But it was just like at the end they did the longest encore.
Lizzy: Oh that's cool.
Lissa: And yeah, it was just really cool. So those stand out to me. There are definitely other smaller shows that I enjoyed too, like smaller venues and also even Vegas shows that I felt like were cool.
Lizzy: Okay., my God. I saw Boyz II Men in Vegas.
Lissa: Oh, did you? I want to see them.
Lizzy: And they were so good and I got to go up on stage.
Lissa: Oh, really?
Lizzy: It was small.
Lissa: Yeah. Yeah.
Lizzy: It was a really small venue, but they were so good.
Lissa: I see that. I saw Janet Jackson there, and it's obviously like a Vegas show if you haven't been. They're slightly different than a whole concert production. I feel like the artists sing less because they have to sing night after night.
Lizzy: Night after night, yeah.
Lissa: So a lot of it is the show itself, like the dancers and stuff. So it's still a great production, it's just different from a headliner show like a Taylor Swift or Beyonce.
Lizzy: Yeah, for sure.
Lissa: What about you?
Lizzy: A few come to mind. So probably my favorite, I saw Stevie Wonder with my dad and my uncle in 2014. So his probably most famous album, one of the arguably greatest albums of all time, is Songs of The Key of Life. And he did a tour of that. And he's my favorite artist of all time, and so that was just incredible because obviously he came a lot before me. And to be able to see him perform those songs, which the album came out in the 70s, was incredible. And he sounded like Stevie Wonder. It was him.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: So that one, and then probably Lady Gaga. I went with one of my friends, she just got tickets. We go to concerts together a lot. In fact, she just texted me about one. And yeah, we got tickets, she was played at Dodger Stadium. I've been a Gaga fan-ish, not a huge fan, but I've always liked her. She was incredible.
Lissa: Yeah?
Lizzy: Just the vocals, the emotion, the performance, it was mind-blowing. So that just for the performance and the talent itself was so good.
Lissa: The talent goes a long way because I feel like there's so many music artists out there that are talented, but to get the once in a lifetime type of talent and hear them live is just a different experience.
Lizzy: Oh yeah, it's unreal. So I'm more drawn to vocalists I think just in general musically. I love R&B and singer/songwriters, but in live performances where you can hear how they sound live. Another one that actually comes to mind, I've seen Lauryn Hill a couple times. She's one of my favorite artists. But I went to a conference called Brand Week, and it's big conference and so they have big artists. And so, Lauryn Hill was one of them. They also had Anthony Hamilton on a different night in different venue and no one knew who he was. So I'm like here to Anthony Hamilton, and same with Lauryn Hill. I was like a few feet away from her. There was maybe a hundred people. It was just trippy and cool. You know?
Lissa: Yeah. Yeah.
Lizzy: So that was another good one.
Lissa: Have you ever been front and center? Oh, once with me.
Lizzy: With you at Miguel. We were front center. We were I think second row at J. Cole or somewhere. We were very close.
Lissa: In San Francisco?
Lizzy: At Oracle.
Lissa: All right. Right, right, right.
Lizzy: Yeah, yeah. That's probably the only times. The Miguel one, we paid a little bit more, but it was at a unique venue because it was a Hollywood cemetery, so it wasn't super expensive, I don't think. The J. Cole we paid up for, but that's my guy.
Lissa: Yeah. I was front and center for Miguel and then Drake in Future.
Lizzy: Oh, yeah.
Lissa: I went all the way to D.C. to do that with my cousin. And then, it just came to mind. I got to see Snoop front and center. It was a private concert.
Lizzy: That's cool.
Lissa: We had a work, I can't remember if it was a holiday party or a company offsite. It probably was a holiday party. I can't remember. They rented out a movie studio here, and our head of the music department obviously has connections and connected to Snoop. So Snoop did a whole private concert for the company. And me being a fan, I camped out for the two hours leading up to the performance so that I could be in the front.
Lizzy: Gotcha.
Lissa: And it was hilarious because it was a work event, but he was smoking weed. He was doing what Snoop does.
Lizzy: That's crazy.
Lissa: It was kind of awkward for a lot of people, but I was like, "Whatever, enjoy this moment." But yeah.
Lizzy: That reminds me of Tiny Desk. I wish that would be so amazing to see a Tiny Desk in real life.
Lissa: I got to see Janelle Monae in a situation like that too.
Lizzy: Really?
Lissa: Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Lizzy: That's so cool.
Lissa: So I don't know. I'm very blessed. Sometimes I talk shit about my last job because of my promotion trajectory. But the job itself, the company itself-
Lizzy: It was amazing.
Lissa: ... was dope.
Lizzy: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Absolutely, yeah.
Lissa: Super cool. So something that I didn't tell you and now I kind of feel bad. So my bachelorette weekend is coming up. Liz is planning it because she's my maid of honor. But I added a concert on that trip and a couple of us were going. If you want to go, you could still get a ticket.
Lizzy: All right.
Lissa: The day that we get there, the day I get there, Craig David plays at the O2.
Lizzy: Oh.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: I've been to the O2.
Lissa: Oh, you have?
Lizzy: Uh-huh. I saw John Legend there.
Lissa: Oh, really?
Lizzy: In 2008. Yeah.
Lissa: I don't know how much you like Craig David, but we were just like Craig David in London.
Lizzy: I mean, I'd be down, yeah.
Lissa: It's fun.
Lizzy: For sure.
Lissa: So we'll talk about it. Yeah.
Lizzy: His fine ass.
Lissa: It just came out. So here's the thing. Like I said, post-pandemic, it's not a priority for me. I don't budget for concerts. I don't go out of my way to go to them. And I even just recently told my husband, "Yeah, I don't think you should ever surprise me with concert tickets. I think you should check with me first if I want to."
Lizzy: Really?
Lissa: Uh-huh. Because I feel like that's not my priority.
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: I would appreciate it and I would love it, but if you surprise me with tickets and I'm just like, "Oh, I'm too tired. I don't want to go-"
Lizzy: Got it. Yeah.
Lissa: ... "On this particular date," which sounds a little bratty, but I was just like, "No, let's decide together if we're going to go to concerts."
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: So I'm just not an active concert goer I would say. But my cousin, who's also going to be on this trip, texted me last week and she's like, "Hey. I don't want to mess up with your plans, but just so you know, Craig David is playing." And she's one of my cousins that that whole concert era of mine, we were concert goers together.
Lizzy: I think that's cool.
Lissa: Yeah. So then I'm like, "I can't say no. Why not? Go hard or go home."
Lizzy: Why not? Why not?
Lissa: Yeah. Well, here's the why not, because I was like, "That's the first night of the trip when we have this whole weekend planned where we're going to go out, do all these things. Am I going to be tired?"
Lizzy: Yeah, fair. Fair.
Lissa: I don't know. Maybe I'm not giving myself enough credit. Maybe I can rally. I don't know. I just feel like the older I get-
Lizzy: But it's your party. If you're tired, we chill.
Lissa: Oh, yeah.
Lizzy: It's all about you, girl.
Lissa: All right, all right. Anyway, so Craig David.
Lizzy: All right. Let's do it.
Lissa: Something related to Craig David, this has to do with I guess the community around concert goers. I had another friend who mentioned that she was going to go to this Craig David concert to someone else, and he didn't know who she was talking about. And she was like, 'Wait, you don't know Craig David is?" And to me it's kind of interesting because music connects so many people. Your friendships typically are the same music style, for the most part. You can have friends of all different genres, but I'd say a lot of what I see is your closest group of friends like similar music to you.
Lizzy: Yeah. Well, just thinking, like I said, I've been to so many concerts with you and one of my other best friends, Jackie; looking back at that list, it's pretty much been with the two of you. And the last three concerts I think I've been to have been with her because now she's taking her kids, and so that's a whole different experience. But yeah, that's fundamental to our friendships.
Lissa: Well, that's what I wanted to ask you about. So Liz here, she's so hip, unlike me, who likes to stay at home now. Liz, in the last year, you've gone to Billie Eilish, you've gone to Post Malone.
Lizzy: Yeah, maybe more.
Lissa: Yeah. How's the experience now versus I guess in our twenties?
Lizzy: It's different. Yeah. So right now, I'm not really actively seeking out concerts.
Lissa: They just fall in your lap.
Lizzy: They fall in my lap, yeah. Someone will invite me, lately, yeah, my friend Jackie. And I'll be like, "Yeah, sure." She has four kids. I went with her to take two of her kids to their first concert, which is really cool. That was so interesting because at Post Malone, it was an outdoor venue. Again, I'm a Post Malone fan, but a casual fan. He was great lice. But her daughter is 13, and Jackie, we met in college, she's cool. She can dance. She's beautiful. She's always been very cool. And her daughter was so embarrassed by her. And so, that was the funniest thing to be like this woman who could pull any man if she wanted was just so dope.
Lissa: Is an embarrassing mom.
Lizzy: Is now the embarrassing mom.
Lissa: At a concert.
Lizzy: And her daughter's like, "Stop dancing, mom. Stop dancing." An I'm like, "Whoa, this is different."
Lissa: That's funny.
Lizzy: So yeah, it was cool. Seeing them see Billie Eilish was really cool because that was a huge production. It was in an arena and the lights were crazy and the sound. And the fandom was different, so her fans did not stop singing the words the entire concert; which is another thing is I want to hear her, I don't really want to hear the crowd.
Lissa: I have a side story for that.
Lizzy: But yeah, so the experience of it and the energy was a little different, so that was really cool.
Lissa: This is unrelated to concerts, but that just made me think of, I watched Wicked recently, but we went to Wicked the Sing-along. And I didn't choose this because Alan and I went to go visit my family for Christmas and my sister was like, "Do you want to come to Wicked sing-along with us the day after Christmas?" We hadn't seen Wicked, so we're like, "Sure, why not? Let's kill two birds with one stone. We'll watch Wicked with you guys even though it's a sing-along."
Lizzy: Even though it's a sing-along.
Lissa: Oh, my God.
Lizzy: There's a lot to sing.
Lissa: Here's what annoyed me is that fine, I understand everyone in the theater is going to be singing. Fine. That's what I signed up for. Right?
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: But they were also reciting every line. So I'm like, "I'm not trying to hear you say the lines to this movie."
Lizzy: Song the songs, just sing the songs.
Lissa: Just sing the songs.
Lizzy: Yeah, it's on act-along.
Lissa: It's not an act-along. So anyway, so very different.
Lizzy: I'd really never heard of that. I didn't know that was a thing.
Lissa: Yeah, sing-along. Well, I guess it's very unique. It depends if a musical is that catchy or not.
Lizzy: Okay.
Lissa: Anyway, but on concert. So you don't like when people sing, or you do?
Lizzy: It was more like if it's... So two pet peeves, two concert pet peeves.
Lissa: Concert, yeah.
Lizzy: I hate when people stand when it's a seated concert, you have an assigned seat, and people stand the entire concert.
Lissa: Right. It's okay if you get up here and there for the big moment.
Lizzy: Yeah, for a certain moment.
Lissa: Right.
Lizzy: But this time, they stood from the moment she came on stage. And fortunately I'm tall, so I sat down. I sat down. But then, in my head I'm like, "Do I look like the who's not having a good time?"
Lissa: No,
Lizzy: I'm having a great time. I'm just comfortable.
Lissa: But the same goes for sporting events. It's a domino effect.
Lizzy: I hate it.
Lissa: If the front row seated stands up, everyone behind them has to stand up.
Lizzy: Like last two minutes, crunch time, yes.
Lissa: Yes. Right.
Lizzy: Big song, yes. The whole concert, why do we have seats?
Lissa: Yeah. And I am 5'2", 5'1", 5'2", so it sucks. That's kind of part of the reason too I justify buying expensive tickets.
Lizzy: Yeah. Sure.
Lissa: So I have a view.
Lizzy: A view. I get it.
Lissa: Because if I'm in standing room only and I'm behind a person.
Lizzy: Yeah. Her son is little, he's 10, and he had a broken foot.
Lissa: Oh. So he can't even stand.
Lizzy: So I'm like, "He has to stand?" I'm like, "You can come sit on my lap."
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: So that's number one. And then, I guess when people sing the entire concert and it's enough people, I would imagine it's similar to a Taylor Swift concert where it's like you just can't hear her.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: So the third one I thought of.
Lissa: So there's a lot of downsides to concerts.
Lizzy: Third one I thought of is this one I'd never noticed before, but the light production was a strobe kind of effect. And it didn't last. I thought it was going to last the whole concert. It lasted a few songs to start out, where I was like, "I won't be able to sit here."
Lissa: Because you'll get a migraine.
Lizzy: I'll get a migraine. And that actually can give people seizures.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: So I was kind of surprised they had it that way at all, but now I'm a lot more sensitive to the light and stuff.
Lissa: Well, I was about to ask, have you ever lost your hearing after a concert?
Lizzy: I don't know that I have. I can't think of an example.
Lissa: I don't know that I have, but I know there's at least one or two concerts I've been to where the standing room, it was like an arena and it's where the basketball court would be on the floor. It was right next to a speaker. And so yeah, I feel like your body has to be able to take a concert: the standing, the sound, the lights.
Lizzy: Yeah. It's a lot. Yeah.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: And also, now that I'm so old-
Lissa: Is this just us being old? I know.
Lizzy: I'm so old.
Lissa: We're not even that old.
Lizzy: And now I'm like, I go to bed at 8:30.
Lissa: We're actually not old, Liz, we're in our thirties. What are you talking about?
Lizzy: But now, because my dog and my life, I go to bed really early. So it started at 8:30. It started at my bedtime.
Lissa: Yeah, see that too.
Lizzy: And then, I have a whole concert, and then I have an hour drive.
Lissa: We're going to have future episodes about is going clubbing worth it. But all these things that happen later in the evening, to me, they don't just mess up your sleep that night.
Lizzy: No.
Lissa: It's for the whole next week or two.
Lizzy: Yeah. Then I'm terrible the next day. And it's on a weeknight. I think it was a Tuesday or something or maybe a Monday, yeah.
Lissa: We're really sounding old right now.
Lizzy: It's interesting, the things that I didn't consider when I was younger.
Lissa: Yeah. You don't notice those things.
Lizzy: I experienced very different.
Lissa: I think when I was younger, I had so many concert experiences where I got maybe too drunk or where I had to stand for five hours straight, and I didn't even think twice about it.
Lizzy: No. Oh, yes.
Lissa: Now, the slightest discomfort, I'm like, "Oh my God, was this the right decision to come?"
Lizzy: Yeah. I think that's probably why I am not seeking them out because that's a lot to navigate. But what is important to me and the thing I value, is experiencing that with someone that I care about with my friends. And particularly the friend I go with lately, she lives kind of far away, so we don't see each other that often. So it's like a thing we can do together, but yeah it's a lot to consider nowadays.
Lissa: I think the last concert I actually bought tickets for, this was post-pandemic, so I was blanking was I bought tickets to see Burna Boy.
Lizzy: Oh, I remember that. Yeah.
Lissa: Because Alan was living in London at the time, my husband, and he was going to come visit. And he always told me that in London it's so hard to get tickets. It's so rare for big artists to come through, and when they do, it's hard to get tickets.
Lizzy: They're so in demand. Yeah.
Lissa: Because the whole country, the whole city and country-
Lizzy: Probably all of Europe, yeah.
Lissa: All of Europe want to get there and attend. And so, I was like, "Oh, well in LA," this was years ago. So Burna Boy was already big around the globe, but still gaining traction here.
Lizzy: Here, yeah. He was more emerging here.
Lissa: Yeah. But he was playing at the Hollywood Bowl. But then, what ended up happening was the borders were still closed from the pandemic. Alan couldn't travel on that concert date because the borders were closed. So I was like, "That's fine, I'll sell them," because I instead went to go visit him instead of going to the concert without him. But I couldn't resell them. I had to resell them for a lower amount. So that's another thing. Are concerts these days, like tickets are transferable? If you can't go, you can just give them to someone else? It doesn't have to be in their name. Right?
Lizzy: Yeah, no. Yeah.
Lissa: Yeah. I feel like I always stress out about you can buy... Because here's another stressor about concerts. If it's a big artist and you're waiting for the pre-sale and the sale, that stress of seeing if you can even get seats, and you don't even have a choice sometimes of where the seat is.
Lizzy: Oh, totally, yeah.
Lissa: That's stressful. It's like if you have money, you don't have to worry about that so much. But if you don't have money.
Lizzy: Yeah, for sure.
Lissa: You can end up on the side where you can't even see the stage.
Lizzy: Yeah. And it goes so fast and people use robots and shit to do it. So it's like, "Can I even get tickets? I'm just going to have to pay resale."
Lissa: Resale prices are crazy.
Lizzy: Or I was thinking of, we've gone to a few festivals like Lovers and Friends or Camp Flogna where they don't even release the full...
Lissa: Lineup?
Lizzy: Lineup before tickets go on sale.
Lissa: Okay. That Lovers and Friends, actually, okay. I didn't completely say no to concerts after the pandemic. I forgot about that one.
Lizzy: You did not have a great experience.
Lissa: I did not have a good-
Lizzy: I had an amazing experience.
Lissa: Yeah. I did not have a great time at Lovers and Friends. It was so hot in Vegas.
Lizzy: It was so hot, it was unsafe.
Lissa: It was unsafe.
Lizzy: It was unsafe. Yeah.
Lissa: And then, I think I got a nosebleed or something and I just, I don't know.
Lizzy: You were sick.
Lissa: I was sick. That's where I caught Covid.
Lizzy: Yes.
Lissa: That's where I caught Covid.
Lizzy: You were sick. Yeah.
Lissa: Look, any place with crowds, there's a chance you could get sick.
Lizzy: Yeah, it's a valid concern. Yeah.
Lissa: You can get sick anywhere, but definitely that's where I got Covid. And then, so this is just a quick story time, is so we went together, and you went with your partner at the time. And we had another friend, like a group.
Lizzy: We had several friends that were there.
Lissa: We couldn't connect with anyone because-
Lizzy: There was no cell service pretty much the entire time.
Lissa: No cell service.
Lizzy: And this is a huge festival.
Lissa: Mm-hmm. So then, at some point I was like, "Look, I'm going to leave because I'm just not going to have fun the rest of this time. It's too hot and whatever." So I wanted to get out of there and get an Uber or a taxi back to my hotel, but no reception and roads were closed. I had to walk miles in that heat to get back to my hotel.
Lizzy: That was logistically the absolute worst concert I've ever been to.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: It was awful.
Lissa: I hope they made it better after that year.
Lizzy: Yeah, I hope so.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: Figuring out where to go, where to park. It's in Las Vegas, so it's already crowded. There were so many people. And it was 115 degrees. It was so hot. And at first, they were saying you couldn't bring water in, and then they ran out of water on the first day. We went the second day. So finally they'd allow you to bring water. So then you have to lug water and umbrellas. I'll say though, it was an amazing concert because it was like-
Lissa: Wasn't it like Fire Festival vibes?
Lizzy: Yeah. Seriously. Seriously.
Lissa: I forgot about that.
Lizzy: But it was so many artists from my high school days that it was amazing.
Lissa: Yeah. So concert goers, it's actually interesting to me because I feel like you're either one or you're not.
Lizzy: Yeah.
Lissa: I guess there's in the middle like us now. We still enjoy them and appreciate them, but don't seek them out. What do you foresee yourself through the rest of your life, like into your forties, fifties, sixties?
Lizzy: I think I'll always go to them periodically. Music is really important to me. I have a running list of people that I want to see that I haven't seen yet. And so, I will try to seek those opportunities out. I want to see Thames, I want to see Chris Stapleton. And so, if they go on tour and there's an opportunity, I'll try to catch it. But I think it will be more sporadic than it used to be, and to some extent, maybe more high end, maybe, maybe not. Sometimes I feel like floor seats aren't worth it because you are closer, but you don't necessarily have a better view because you're on the floor.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: You're not elevated.
Lissa: Yeah, you can't see the whole production.
Lizzy: Yeah. So it's probably going to be venue dependent. I still like going to smaller venues. Oh, I saw SiR. I went to SiR by myself.
Lissa: Oh, yeah. I think you asked me to go with you.
Lizzy: Yeah. Which that's an interesting thing. I've been to a handful of concerts by myself, which was like I really wanted to see someone. No one else I knew wanted to go. I really want to see them, so I'm going to go. That was actually a great one. Small venue, little theater in Hollywood, a cool venue. Parked on the street, walked right up, it was easy, it was great. He was incredible. So that was a good recent one. That was just a couple months ago.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: Yeah. What about you?
Lissa: I think similar. I guess we're kind of giving a foreshadowing of the 20 Cents.
Lizzy: I know. Right.
Lissa: Should we just do it?
Lizzy: Yeah, let's just do it.
Lissa: Let's just to go 20 cents.
Lizzy: Let's just do 20 cents. Yeah.
Lissa: 20 cents. 20 cents is the segment of the show where both Lizzy and myself, Lissa, each get 60 seconds to give our 2 cents on today's topic, whether it's a net positive or a net negative for concerts. Where does 20 cents come from?
Lizzy: You get the opinion of two dimes.
Lissa: Two dimes. So Liz, you're up first, 60 seconds on the clock. Are concerts worth it?
Lizzy: Okay. Yes, concerts are worth it, but they're not nearly as worth it as they used to be for me. There are so many other considerations and logistical discomforts that I didn't notice or care about when I was younger, so they're probably not all worth it. Right? Probably the people I really, really want to see are going to be worth it. And then, people I'm so-so about probably are not worth all of that and the production of it. But for the most part, they are meaningful experiences for me because music is so important to me. And especially when I'm able to go with one of my best friends or someone I care about, it's a cool thing to share.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: So yeah, I'm net positive. Okay. How about you?
Lissa: For me, I think that when we talk about are they worth it, meaning money I would actually spend on them, I'm a net negative. Because right now I have so many other financial priorities that sit above concerts. Not to say if there's a reasonable ticket or someone wants to take me for free or some opportunity like that, I would jump on it if it's an artist I want to see. I still love concerts, but in terms of being worth my money right now, I'd say net negative.
And then, in terms of being worth my time, it would just depend on the situation. If it's just a random week where I'm trying to get a lot of work done, content done, would I go to a concert on a Thursday night? Probably not. But if you're telling me that on my bachelorette trip weekend there's a concert we could go to, why not? Then I'm going to say yes. But I think-
Lizzy: I like it.
Lissa: Yeah, I think all those reasons together. I'm currently a net negative, but I still love concerts.
Lizzy: Yeah. Good framing.
Lissa: Yeah.
Lizzy: One small note, something made me realize I've actually been to quite a few comedy shows recently as well. And for some reason those feel a little easier, even though some of them have also been at big venues and had a lot of the similar-
Lissa: They're shorter.
Lizzy: ... crowd things. They're shorter, and maybe just because laughing the whole time if they're good, so that's kind of another one to throw in there.
Lissa: Yeah. We should throw that in the future episode. Well, this is what we think at this moment in time. Liz is net positive for concerts, I'm net negative, but still invite me if you got free tickets. And we just know that this is... I don't know where I was going with that. This is what we think at this moment in time. No one can make that decision but you. What do you think? Are concerts worth it?
Lizzy: Let us know what you think. DM us on Instagram, @netnetpodcast or email us at hi@netnetpodcast.com. And if you want to follow us individually, here's where you can find us.
Lissa: I'm @wealthforwomenofcolor on YouTube, TikTok, and Instagram.
Lizzy: And I'm @live_well_Lizzy on Instagram and TikTok.
Lissa: All references, statistics, and resources mentioned can be found in our show notes. This podcast is for educational, informational, and entertainment purposes only, and should not be constituted as financial advice. Remember to always do your own research, consult a professional as needed, and feel empowered to make your own damn decisions.